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Fred Kerley moved from 400m to running 100m to work on this speed. He managed to qualify and represent USA at the Tokyo Olympics, He won a silver there, by the way. He intends to eventually go back to running 400m.

If she is indeed only 17 years old, Shaili Singh is definitely a future Olympic medal prospect, if not in 2024, then certainly in 2028 -- although I'll be greedy and want medals at both. We need to nurture her the way Neeraj Chopra was nurtured after winning gold at the U-20 world championship five years ago.

PKBasu wrote: ↑Mon Aug 23, 2021 9:32 am If she is indeed only 17 years old, Shaili Singh is definitely a future Olympic medal prospect, if not in 2024, then certainly in 2028 -- although I'll be greedy and want medals at both. We need to nurture her the way Neeraj Chopra was nurtured after winning gold at the U-20 world championship five years ago.

Shaili is coached by Bobby George who has prior experience with Anju at the top level. I am also hopeful that she will be ready in 3 years.

Yes, probably we may not need a foreign coach here which is Jay's pre-requisite for a medal at an olympics.

This is an article with quotes from Bobby George-

Indian long jumper Shaili Singh misses gold by 1 cm at U20 Worlds

6.59 which she achieved yesterday would have given her gold at last Asian games and she would have finished 5th at last commonwealth games. But, such comparison is not correct as her mark yesterday was wind aided and was achieved in high altitude conditions. So, she is mostly at 6.45-6.55 level right now. Any medal at Asian games and commonwealth games will be good at this age.

We will need to be realistic about expectations. She will be only 18 next year and 20 at the time of Paris olympics. I saw Tokyo olympics results of long jump and the youngest compeitior in final was 23 years and she was way off medal. So, realistic expectation for her would be a medal in 2028 when she would be 24 and at the peak of her prowess. That is if she remains injury free and not fall off in between like Hima Das currently has.

suresh wrote: ↑Mon Aug 23, 2021 6:07 am Fred Kerley moved from 400m to running 100m to work on this speed. He managed to qualify and represent USA at the Tokyo Olympics, He won a silver there, by the way. He intends to eventually go back to running 400m.

If Hima Das manages to improve her speed by this switch to 200m and thus eventually improves her 400m time and standing, that would be really good. Kerley going back from 400m to 100m and then planning to come back to 400 is strange. Normally they shift from 100-200 to 400 if at all age permits continuation at the highest level. His dramatic improvement in 100m in 2021 is also surprsing (from 10.49 in 2015 to 9.84 in 2021). Whatever reason that might have prompted a man listed third in the 2019 lists for 400m (43.63s) to think that he needed 100-200 to gain more speed might never be known. Hima Das's best in 400m in 2018 (50.79s) was 23rd in the world that year. She has improved her 100m PB from 11.74 to 11.63s this year and 200m from 23.10 in 2018 to 22.88s this year. Doesn't look to be heading towards anything either in 100m, 200m or 400m or 4x100m.

Mugundan wrote: ↑Mon Aug 23, 2021 12:36 pm Kerley going back from 400m to 100m and then planning to come back to 400 is strange. Normally they shift from 100-200 to 400 if at all age permits continuation at the highest level. His dramatic improvement in 100m in 2021 is also surprsing (from 10.49 in 2015 to 9.84 in 2021). Whatever reason that might have prompted a man listed third in the 2019 lists for 400m (43.63s) to think that he needed 100-200 to gain more speed might never be known.

Kerley wants to go under 43s in the 400m. His wikipedia page says that. I also heard the same from commentators during the US Olympics Trials. Of course, Kerley is at a different level from Hima Das.

I do not think Fred Kerley’s switxh was motivated to improve his 400! He seems like a more natural sprinter who may have realized that he had better chances in 100 this year Round

As to Hima’s switch, I am inclined to give benefit of doubt to her coaches! 400 is the toughtest of the races! Considering that 400m is essentially 2 times 200 meter adding 2 additional seconds for each 200m , I have no problems with her focussing on 200m to improve her 400 chances

sameerph wrote: ↑Mon Aug 23, 2021 11:50 am Yes, probably we may not need a foreign coach here which is Jay's pre-requisite for a medal at an olympics.

No, Shaili needs a foreign coach. Anju and husband Bobby won't do, most probably. Anju and Bobby come close to meeting the pre-requisite. If Anju had a foreign coach and enough training abroad (or Bobby did), maybe that would be enough. But that was not the case, except for a one-month stint with Mike Powell in the US. So I am not convinced. Till Shaili gets a foreign coach (a top one who has coached an Olympics or World Championship medalist), I will not count an Olympics medal from her. Will be very happy if Bobby proves me wrong, but I don't know if he can.

Kumar wrote: ↑Mon Aug 23, 2021 3:41 pm As to Hima’s switch, I am inclined to give benefit of doubt to her coaches! 400 is the toughest of the races! Considering that 400m is essentially 2 times 200 meter adding 2 additional seconds for each 200m , I have no problems with her focussing on 200m to improve her 400 chances

If this was truly focusing on 200m to improve in 400m, okay, maybe there is some logic, even if it doesn't seem to be a common practice... I don't think the quartet of decision-makers knows that the rest of the world doesn't, but I can grudgingly accept an experiment. But that is if we are to believe this rather fantastic explanation of what happened to Hima.

But I think we are missing Mugu's implication. He was saying that this was just a cooked-up thing, and that the real reason is something else that we don't know. I have to agree. No way they were going to do this highfalutin experiment in the lead-up year to the Olympics. It makes no sense.

jayakris wrote: ↑Mon Aug 23, 2021 3:46 pm

sameerph wrote: ↑Mon Aug 23, 2021 11:50 am Yes, probably we may not need a foreign coach here which is Jay's pre-requisite for a medal at an olympics.

No, Shaili needs a foreign coach. Anju and husband Bobby won't do, most probably. Anju and Bobby come close to meeting the pre-requisite. If Anju had a foreign coach and enough training abroad (or Bobby did), maybe that would be enough. But that was not the case, except for a one-month stint with Mike Powell in the US. So I am not convinced. Till Shaili gets a foreign coach (a top one who has coached an Olympics or World Championship medalist), I will not count an Olympics medal from her. Will be very happy if Bobby proves me wrong, but I don't know if he can.

Bobby did take Anju pretty close to an Olympic medal. But, perhaps if she had gone to a foreign coach that pretty close could have turned into a medal.

Shaili will find it difficult though to break away from Bobby and Anju as they literally plucked her from Zanshi when she was very raw and taken her to the level she is now. Maybe after 2024 Olympics if she does not improve sufficiently till then and she becomes old enough to take such tough decisions.

jayakris wrote: ↑Mon Aug 23, 2021 3:46 pm

sameerph wrote: ↑Mon Aug 23, 2021 11:50 am Yes, probably we may not need a foreign coach here which is Jay's pre-requisite for a medal at an olympics.

No, Shaili needs a foreign coach. Anju and husband Bobby won't do, most probably. Anju and Bobby come close to meeting the pre-requisite. If Anju had a foreign coach and enough training abroad (or Bobby did), maybe that would be enough. But that was not the case, except for a one-month stint with Mike Powell in the US. So I am not convinced. Till Shaili gets a foreign coach (a top one who has coached an Olympics or World Championship medalist), I will not count an Olympics medal from her. Will be very happy if Bobby proves me wrong, but I don't know if he can.

Shaili's progression has been phenomenal. At 21 years Anju did 6.11, at 22 she was 6.37, at 23 reached 6.59. Around 6.59 is the range Shaili looks capable of at present plus or minus 5cm (the wind speed at Nairobi was marginally above at 2.2m/s for her 6.59 jump). Even if we consider she is capable at 17 a jump of 6.50m that would be way ahead of Anju. (Unfortunately, I don't have Anju's jump at 17 or 18 years). Thus there is hope that in another three years she would be past 6.83 (NR) and in another three years touching 7.00m. That is at 23 she could be doing 7-plus. Malaika Mihambo crossed 7.00 at the age of 25. The German, world and Olympic champion, was at 6.40 at the age of 17, 6.70 at 19, 6.90 at 20, 6.95 at 22, 6.99 at 24 before touching 7.30 in 2019. (She is down to 7.03 and 7.00 in 2020 and 2021, but maintaining 7.00 is always very difficult). Might not be the best example for progression but being a champion right now, her graph looks best suited for discussion. There is always the problem that an Indian athlete may not progress as per plans. gets stuck around 6.80 or 6.85 which could be just a few centimetres short of the desired distance at that point of time. It can happen. But a foreign coach (alone) might not be the answer to Shaili and India getting an Olympic medal. My hunch is Bobby will eventually prove Jay wrong!

I thought Anju Bobby George did win a World Championship medal, so Bobby George meets that criteria if he was her coach then....

arjun2761 wrote: ↑Tue Aug 24, 2021 2:34 am I thought Anju Bobby George did win a World Championship medal, so Bobby George meets that criteria if he was her coach then....

Yes, Bobby George was the coach of Anju in 2003 when she won the bronze in the World championships. Prior to the championships she had trained under Mike Powell in the US for some time. There was no improvement to her PB of 6.74 (achieved in 2001 and 2002) while winning the bronze with 6.70m at Paris. She did gain in confidence under Powell, she had said then. She reached 6.83m (NR) in the Athens Olympics in 2004 and that remains the National record to date.

suresh wrote: ↑Mon Aug 23, 2021 6:07 am Fred Kerley moved from 400m to running 100m to work on this speed. He managed to qualify and represent USA at the Tokyo Olympics, He won a silver there, by the way. He intends to eventually go back to running 400m.

Absolutely, Suresh. Runners have moved distances around to find their sweet-spot. I was wondering why a back injury would force someone to move to a faster race!

Update: Seems like she does not have the endurance to run 400m. Hima shifts She will build up the endurance and then come back in the 400. That makes sense. It is more about her conditioning rather than the bad back (which may have caused the conditioning to go down when she had to rest).

Those are old updates prasen.

I would agree with mugu that something is suspicious. She was 23rd best in the world at age 18 and has regressed badly since.

I have a couple of questions for mugu.

a. opinions on a white Italian winning the 100m and 4x100m; and the sudden influx of very good white sprinters in both the men and women.
b. sudden improvement in top level sprint time, including women getting close (or going past) to peak doping times from the 80s.