Indian Athletics Thread ...

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Re: Indian Athletics Thread ...

Post by sameerph »

Neeraj Chopra participated in a tournament in India after a long time at Federation cup today.

He won gold but with a modest throw of 82.79. DP Manu won silver with 82.06. Jena again threw something like 75M. :-(
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Re: Indian Athletics Thread ...

Post by Mugundan »

Below par performances on concluding day of Fed Cup. Chopra, Jena and Manu apart, most others also performed well below expectations.
There was a sub-46 by Mohd Ajmal in men's 400m final. Chithravel could not touch 17.00m.
https://www.firstpost.com/sports/neeraj ... 71309.html
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Re: Indian Athletics Thread ...

Post by Mugundan »

India can win two medals in Olympics, says Adille Sumariwalla:
https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/spo ... 125269.cms
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Re: Indian Athletics Thread ...

Post by arjun2761 »

Not sure where he is seeing the second medal.

LJ is virtually nil due to injury of Murali Sreeshankar. In 4x400 men, we have exactly 1 Indian among the top 200 times this year and last year. Avinash Sable and TJ are the two others with some prospect but they would likely consider a top 8 finish as a decent effort.
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Re: Indian Athletics Thread ...

Post by Sin Hombre »

TJ has no chances. The only 3 people who had outside chances of a medal are Murali (injured), Avinash and Kishore Jena (out of form).

4x400 has an outside chance if we qualify to the finals (50% odds of that) and 3 or 4 teams get disqualified which is not probable but not impossible.
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Re: Indian Athletics Thread ...

Post by Mugundan »

Yes, our chances in relay/s will depend on disqualification of other teams or one or two teams dropping the baton.
In fact "dropping the baton" by other teams had been talked about within Indian athletics circles for decades!
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Re: Indian Athletics Thread ...

Post by arjun2761 »

I like that optimism! In that case, Avinash could easily medal if all the Africans ahead of him stumble and fall or trip each other. :D
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Re: Indian Athletics Thread ...

Post by Mugundan »

Meetings in Europe on Sunday:
Rehlingen
Women-JT: Annu Rani 56.07 (2)
N-HJ: Tejaswin Shankar 2.14 (5), Jesse Sandesh 2.10 (8)
(Apparently cold conditions in this German city)
Chania, Greece:
M-TJ: Eldhose Paul 16.35 (2)
Italian meet:
M-LJ 7.74 (4 on countback)
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Re: Indian Athletics Thread ...

Post by Mugundan »

The Indian mixed relay team won the gold in the Asian relays championships at Bangkok with a national record time of 3:14.12 (old 3:14.34 at Hangzhou Asian Games) but it was not sufficient to get into the cut for Paris Olympics.
After the World Relays in The Bahamas, the top 14 teams in each relay qualified for Paris. The other two places in the 16-team field are to be filled up based on rankings.
The Czech Republic is at 15th with 3:11.98 and Italy at 16th with 3:13.56.
Before this afternoon, India was 23rd in the lists. After today's timing it is 21st.
The team comprised Mohd Ajmal, Jyothika Dandi Sri, Amoj Jacob and V. Subhha.
The Indian men's and women's 4x400 teams have qualified for Paris.
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Re: Indian Athletics Thread ...

Post by prasen9 »

This is interesting. In principle, if you take the top two men and top two women, then we are not good enough. But, if you take top 4 then we beat out some countries. The advantage of being a bigger country perhaps? We have slightly better depth and thus have decent #3s and #4s and thus pip the other countries but when talking about quality over quantity, we are not that great. Is this logic correct?
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Re: Indian Athletics Thread ...

Post by Mugundan »

Most European countries have better 400m runners in both men and women's section (Not mentioning the US and Jamica here since they are at the very top normally). The hope for India in mixed relay, if they qualify, would be the event is invariably scheduled on the first two days or three. Thus, this time, too, it is on day two and three. Most of the top athletes do not get into mixed teams at Olympics, concentrating on their individual events. Thus, one or two of the better-ranked teams could go out in the first round. India then would be able to make it into final (provided they qualify for Olympics first). At the Asian level, only Bahrain or Japan can challenge us in mixed relay. Both did not field a team in Bangkok. Bahrain did not finish in the Bahamas and Japan apparently had an injury to one of its male runners thus clocking a poor time in the heats.
Bahrain is 18th at the moment in "Road to Paris" compared to India's 21st place.
The problem with most Asian countries would be, they might have two good woman runners but not men and vice versa (you are right there that when it comes to four we are better off). Like Bahrain has two top women runners but only one good male. Japan has two good male runners but not very good in the female section. The US normally has about a dozen males at sub-45 and that many females sub-51.
Qualification in mixed relay looks tough at the moment.
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Re: Indian Athletics Thread ...

Post by arjun2761 »

Our 4x400 strength in both men and women is quite surprising when considering that we don't have top 100 runners individually. So, our depth is likely helping us. I also wonder if our 400 m runners aren't very explosive and don't have good starts but 3 of the 4 runners in the relay get running starts so perhaps aren't held back by their slower starts. Just speculation on my part because otherwise our 4x400 strength at the world level is hard to explain.
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Re: Indian Athletics Thread ...

Post by Sin Hombre »

It is both depth and what mugu said, the best 400m runners sometimes try to protect themselves.
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Re: Indian Athletics Thread ...

Post by Mugundan »

The first leg invariably will be slower ("Invariably" only because someone like Michael Johnson, if he ever was on an opening leg might have run faster. Otherwise always slower)
Block starts would always be slower compared to running starts. This is true of 4x100m also.
Take the World Relays 2024 in The Bahamas
Indian men in Round 2: 3:03.23 (2nd behind USA 2:59.95)
Splits: Anas 46.36, Ajmal 45.01, Arokia Rajiv 46.11, Amoj Jacob 45.75
Indian women : Round 1:
5th. 3:29.74
Vithya Ramraj 54.08
Poovamma 52.87
Jyothika Sri 51.13
Subha V 51.66
Round 2:
2nd: 3:29.35
Rupal Chaudhary 54.26
Jyothika Sri 50.92
Poovamma 52.44
Subha V 51.73
These split timings might not be accurate though they are from a World meet. Yet, they give us an idea about each runner.
Normally, we add 1.00 to 1.5s to the split timings on leg-2,3 and 4 to arrive at a rough timing about how fast the runner was.
Thus, for Indian men in round-2, Anas will remain at 46.36 while others would be: Ajmal 46.01, Rajiv 47.11, Jacob 46.75
Same type of calculations for the women. Basically, we try to figure out the intrinsic value of each leg timing.
In recent times, the media and social media have unfortunately tended to project the second and third-leg timings as PBs of a runner which they are not.
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Re: Indian Athletics Thread ...

Post by arjun2761 »

Yes, these splits are quite what one would expect. That is, each one is running 46+ when adjusted for running start.

However, I recall that when we did 2:59+ in the Mens 4x400, our first split was what one would expect but runners 2-4 had splits that were quite surprising. So, it would be interesting if our 2-4 runners do relatively better with a running start compared to their normal 400m timing (i.e., when relative to the athletes they are running with).
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