Ravichandran Ashwin: All-time great

[Atithee]

Allan Border, Steve Waugh, Hansie Cronje, Asif Iqbal, Shakib Al Hasan, …. there are many great all rounders who didn’t bowl enough. Andrew Symonds, etc. who didn’t play long enough.

[rajitghosh]

Shakib will make it to the elite club. Out of the rest not sure Symcox can be called an all rounder. Rather Klusener was but he never made it anywhere close to 3000+300. Out of the rest only Steve Waugh was a genuine allrounder when he bowled regularly but injuries got him. Rest were not of the class to get to 300 wickets even if they bowled regularly.

[PKBasu]

So 10 of them have made 3000+300 but only 6 have done 3000+400. Am I right?

Yes.

[PKBasu]

But 3000+400 shouldn't be the standard for the greatest allrounder lists. If Sobers isn't on the list, that cannot be the standard.

Is there a standard with average run per test, plus average wickets per test? Like 35+ batting and 3.5+ bowling? The kind that might bring some old greats who played much fewer tests (like Vinoo Mankad) into consideration among say top-15 allrounders?

You're absolutely right, Jay. These are achievements for bowling all-rounders. Sobers was a batting all-rounder, and (like Vinoo Mankad) a genuine all-rounder who could have played tests for his team as a specialist batsman or specialist bowler.

Ashwin has played 5 fewer tests than Sobers but taken nearly double the number of wickets Sobers took. But Sobers has far more than double the runs Ashwin has. So other criteria are needed to assess who the truly great all-rounders are. Ashwin cannot, in all fairness, be considered a good enough batsman to play as a specialist batter in tests. Jadeja actually is a more genuine all-rounder in that sense.

[PKBasu]

Sobers was one of the greatest batsmen of all time, who was also a good world-class bowler. Similar to the description I'd use for Jacques Kallis, whose numbers are almost as good as Sobers'.

Shakib al-Hasan has 231 wickets in 65 wicket (Sobers had 235 in 93), and has also scored 4365 runs, at 38+ per innings. His wickets have come at 31 apiece. His bowling numbers are better than Sobers, but he is only a moderately good (but definitely world-class) batsman. A very genuine all-rounder.

[Kumar]

Interview with Ashwin.

https://indianexpress.com/article/sport ... t-8665087/

He probably has the most self awareness of any sportsman that I have watched. Has that helped him become what he is? Or did it limit him?

I always believed I had great leadership qualities in me. And always believed that I could be a good leader because it’s not about leading on the field. It’s leading men.
However, when that journey (leading KingsXI Punjab) came to an end, I figured I needed to work on my intra-personal skills. It wasn’t the greatest, but I had to go through that journey to understand it. Because, how intense I am as a cricketer is not necessarily somebody else’s journey.

Do you all think that he will reach 100 test matches? India will play 19 matches, 10 at home and 9 on road (WI, Australia and SA).

[Kumar]

By the way, the amount of attack on Ashwin seems really Bizarre. After Harbhajan singh who consistently attacks Ashwin, it is now the turn of L Sivaramakrishnan to question Ashwin's performance.


https://sports.ndtv.com/cricket/look-at ... in-4438765

If not for CSK and MSD , he would have to wait longer as Harbhajan was bowling superbly at that time. Played for India, Left India Cement and went and joined the Rival Company Chemplast. What LOYALTY FROM THE GREAT MAN. You must build a temple for him. 1 full white ball state tournament bowled Leg Spin, Anyone else would have been kicked out," he posted on the social media platform.

some of the comments with regards to Ashwin performance in doctored pitches may hit close to mark, but saying he got selected because of his connections and that Harbhajan was bowling superbly does not reflect truth.

Harbhajan in test matches played in india in 2009, 2010, 2012 had average of 41, 34 and 42 and ODI average of 34 (2009) and 43(2011).
Ashwin in 2010 had 22.91 and had 27 in 2011. Harbhajan had the worst bowling average in 2011 wc with an average of 43 worse than Yuvraj Singh .. and just better than Chawla and Pathan. Harbhajan seems to consider that Ashwin was unfairly selected and he did not get a fair run..