India in South Africa, January 2018
Moderator: Moderators
- PKBasu
- Member
- Posts: 36880
- Joined: Fri Jan 03, 2003 6:04 pm
- Please enter the middle number: 1
- Location: New Delhi / Kolkata
- Been thanked: 8 times
Re: India in South Africa, January 2018
If Par-sieve and Pujara, the Gujarati boys, manage to last until lunch, India will win.
The similarity with THAT Eden day is that Parthiv is playing his last test innings if he doesn't come good (a la Dravid that day). And Pujara lacks Laxman's flair, but he has even greater doggedness.
The pitch is difficult to bat on, but perhaps another roller tomorrow morning will smoothen the cracks...
The similarity with THAT Eden day is that Parthiv is playing his last test innings if he doesn't come good (a la Dravid that day). And Pujara lacks Laxman's flair, but he has even greater doggedness.
The pitch is difficult to bat on, but perhaps another roller tomorrow morning will smoothen the cracks...
- arjun2761
- Member
- Posts: 7390
- Joined: Sun Apr 03, 2005 2:26 pm
- Please enter the middle number: 1
- Location: US
- Been thanked: 11 times
Re: India in South Africa, January 2018
In the post 90s era, we have generally been good at home and poor in the SANE countries. That trend is seemingly continuing although we are now invincible at home and somewhat competitive (our quicks are a little quicker but still far worse than the SANE quicks) but still poor in the SANE countries. So, some improvement but we are hardly the dominant team in test cricket like the WI or Australian teams in the past.
- prasen9
- Member
- Posts: 19256
- Joined: Thu Jan 02, 2003 8:49 pm
- Please enter the middle number: 1
- Location: State College, PA
- Has thanked: 41 times
- Been thanked: 10 times
- Contact:
Re: India in South Africa, January 2018
If we compare the Indian and the South African bowlers, Philander has averaged 13 runs/wicket (!), Ishant 17, Morkel 20, Kumar 20, Shami 20, Ngidi 22, Rabada 23, Steyn 26, Ashwin 31. Given this, why are we playing Ashwin? Why not go with another pacer who can bowl such as playing Bhuvi, Ishant, Shami, and oops, Bumrah is at 35. So, I guess Ashwin is better. Maybe use Umesh for T3 instead of Bumrah? Ishant, Kumar, and Shami have bowled well. It seems Ashwin, Bumrah, and Pandya have not --- relatively speaking. Relatively because the bowling failures are nowhere close to the atrocious batting failures. Pandya's averaging 48 with the ball has really hurt. We should consider him like a Ganguly-type bowler. Play him as a sixth bat because he is better than Rohit or Jadeja and bowl him only if needed to rest the top four.
-
- Member
- Posts: 3977
- Joined: Fri Oct 21, 2011 7:35 am
- Antispam: No
- Please enter the middle number: 5
- Location: Pune
Re: India in South Africa, January 2018
this is true in some sense, we have become invincible at home as you have called it however i believe last 5-7 yrs we gave away all the good progress we made at the start of 2000 ...I have not checked the record before that as i believe the team started performing to some extent in these countries under Saurav...here are the records for refarjun2761 wrote: ↑Tue Jan 16, 2018 5:48 pmIn the post 90s era, we have generally been good at home and poor in the SANE countries. That trend is seemingly continuing although we are now invincible at home and somewhat competitive (our quicks are a little quicker but still far worse than the SANE quicks) but still poor in the SANE countries. So, some improvement but we are hardly the dominant team in test cricket like the WI or Australian teams in the past.
T W L D
in Australia 2000-2015 17 2 10 0 5
in Australia 2000-2008 9 2 4 0 3
in Australia 2011-2015 8 0 6 0 2
in England 2002-2014 16 3 8 0 5
in England 2002-2007 7 2 1 0 4
in England 2011-2014 9 1 7 0 1
in New Zealand 2002-2014 7 1 3 0 3
in New Zealand 2002-2009 5 1 2 0 2
in New Zealand 2014-2014 2 0 1 0 1
in South Africa 2001-2018 12 2 6 0 3
in South Africa 2001-2010 7 2 4 0 1
in South Africa 2011-2018 4 0 2 0 2
we just do not understand what it takes for us to win and prepare, we allowed Fab4 extra series as well last time and suffered consequences...did not spend any time in knowing who or who can not play on such tracks..here again just plain stupid team selection..
- VReddy
- Member
- Posts: 759
- Joined: Fri Jan 27, 2006 3:34 pm
- Please enter the middle number: 1
- Location: Zurich, Switzerland
- Contact:
Re: India in South Africa, January 2018
To be fair, Pujara is more of a flat track bully. He averages 27 in SA/AUS/ENG/NZ and 63 in other places. Laxman / Dravid, on the other hand, used to struggle at home and do well in those tough places.PKBasu wrote: ↑Tue Jan 16, 2018 5:37 pm If Par-sieve and Pujara, the Gujarati boys, manage to last until lunch, India will win.
The similarity with THAT Eden day is that Parthiv is playing his last test innings if he doesn't come good (a la Dravid that day). And Pujara lacks Laxman's flair, but he has even greater doggedness.
The pitch is difficult to bat on, but perhaps another roller tomorrow morning will smoothen the cracks...
I wonder a bit on why he is so well-regarded here especially when most of you are so data driven otherwise.
- prasen9
- Member
- Posts: 19256
- Joined: Thu Jan 02, 2003 8:49 pm
- Please enter the middle number: 1
- Location: State College, PA
- Has thanked: 41 times
- Been thanked: 10 times
- Contact:
Re: India in South Africa, January 2018
I am with you fully. I think we get lured by the fact that he gets beaten less often abroad than the others. So he at least lasts a while while the others are falling like pins around him. That makes the illusion that he is useful and is close to turning the corner. But this has gone too long. At one point, Pujara was worse than Dhawan abroad. He also started well in RSA. And since then it has been downhill. In a previous post, I did say that we need to move Rahane to #3 and find a #5 in Iyer or Nair. Or someone else.
-
- Moderators
- Posts: 32924
- Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 4:26 pm
- Antispam: No
- Please enter the middle number: 5
- Location: MUMBAI
- Has thanked: 1 time
- Been thanked: 16 times
Re: India in South Africa, January 2018
That useless series at home against Sri Lanka did nothing much good for us except for improve our home record further. We could have used that time for better preparation for South Africa tour. Perhaps made this tour a longer one of 4 tests instead of 3 and have a couple of practice games. I think SA were keen on having a boxing day test which we refused due to Sri Lanka series.
Now, a one off test is planned against Afganistan in June just before we go to England for another stern test. This will unnecessarily disturb our preparation again.
Now, a one off test is planned against Afganistan in June just before we go to England for another stern test. This will unnecessarily disturb our preparation again.
-
- Moderators
- Posts: 32924
- Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 4:26 pm
- Antispam: No
- Please enter the middle number: 5
- Location: MUMBAI
- Has thanked: 1 time
- Been thanked: 16 times
Re: India in South Africa, January 2018
On the top of it , he gets run out second time in a match. Is there anything more stupid than getting run out in both innings of a test match when time is not a factor ?VReddy wrote: ↑Tue Jan 16, 2018 9:11 pmTo be fair, Pujara is more of a flat track bully. He averages 27 in SA/AUS/ENG/NZ and 63 in other places. Laxman / Dravid, on the other hand, used to struggle at home and do well in those tough places.PKBasu wrote: ↑Tue Jan 16, 2018 5:37 pm If Par-sieve and Pujara, the Gujarati boys, manage to last until lunch, India will win.
The similarity with THAT Eden day is that Parthiv is playing his last test innings if he doesn't come good (a la Dravid that day). And Pujara lacks Laxman's flair, but he has even greater doggedness.
The pitch is difficult to bat on, but perhaps another roller tomorrow morning will smoothen the cracks...
I wonder a bit on why he is so well-regarded here especially when most of you are so data driven otherwise.
Parthiv and now Pandya gone to. 83/6.
-
- Member
- Posts: 5788
- Joined: Fri Nov 26, 2010 6:59 pm
- Antispam: No
- Please enter the middle number: 5
- Location: Chicago
- Has thanked: 5 times
- Been thanked: 5 times
Re: India in South Africa, January 2018
I will have to disagree on the bolded.arjun2761 wrote: ↑Tue Jan 16, 2018 5:48 pmIn the post 90s era, we have generally been good at home and poor in the SANE countries. That trend is seemingly continuing although we are now invincible at home and somewhat competitive (our quicks are a little quicker but still far worse than the SANE quicks) but still poor in the SANE countries. So, some improvement but we are hardly the dominant team in test cricket like the WI or Australian teams in the past.
Our fast bowlers have done at least as well as the SA ones in this series.
They have been let down by disastrous top order batting (no one outside of Kohli is even averaging 20 in the top order vs 3 guys from SA above 40) and ludicrously bad fielding (6 drops in SA's first innings).
-
- Member
- Posts: 5788
- Joined: Fri Nov 26, 2010 6:59 pm
- Antispam: No
- Please enter the middle number: 5
- Location: Chicago
- Has thanked: 5 times
- Been thanked: 5 times
Re: India in South Africa, January 2018
That had more to do with politics.
CSA opposed the BCCI at the last few meetings of ICC while the Lankan board is a loyal supporter.
- PKBasu
- Member
- Posts: 36880
- Joined: Fri Jan 03, 2003 6:04 pm
- Please enter the middle number: 1
- Location: New Delhi / Kolkata
- Been thanked: 8 times
Re: India in South Africa, January 2018
Time to move on from Pujara. Poor outside India, and so it’s pointless persisting with him. Bring on Karun Nair and see what he can do.
Re: India in South Africa, January 2018
Had a chuckle when I read this. I was surprised we crossed into 3 figures. Catching, wicket keeping and running between the wickets was worse than our bowling. The batting was standard fare.If Par-sieve and Pujara, the Gujarati boys, manage to last until lunch, India will win.
- prasen9
- Member
- Posts: 19256
- Joined: Thu Jan 02, 2003 8:49 pm
- Please enter the middle number: 1
- Location: State College, PA
- Has thanked: 41 times
- Been thanked: 10 times
- Contact:
Re: India in South Africa, January 2018
On top of it, Rohit scored some runs. Which probably means Rahane is out for the last test too
- PKBasu
- Member
- Posts: 36880
- Joined: Fri Jan 03, 2003 6:04 pm
- Please enter the middle number: 1
- Location: New Delhi / Kolkata
- Been thanked: 8 times
Re: India in South Africa, January 2018
Naman Ojha and Sreevats Goswami are the next best ‘keepers. It’s silly to go back to Parsieve and DropK
-
- Moderators
- Posts: 32924
- Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 4:26 pm
- Antispam: No
- Please enter the middle number: 5
- Location: MUMBAI
- Has thanked: 1 time
- Been thanked: 16 times