South Africa in India, Sept-Oct 2019

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sameerph
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Re: South Africa in India, Sept-Oct 2019

Post by sameerph » Sat Oct 05, 2019 6:09 pm

Thanks,yes Philander does look a bit fairer than other Africans. There were others like him previously too in WI side- Larry Gomes if anyone remembers or Jeff Dujon.



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Re: South Africa in India, Sept-Oct 2019

Post by prasen9 » Sat Oct 05, 2019 8:28 pm

Prashant wrote:
Sat Oct 05, 2019 6:01 pm
"Coloured" is S. African for mixed race. It is generally considered a pejorative / racist term in the US and most other English speaking parts of the world, and we probably shouldn't countenance it here.
I don't know if it is a pejorative here in the U.S. The NAACP calls itself thus. It is not like the n-word.



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Re: South Africa in India, Sept-Oct 2019

Post by PKBasu » Sun Oct 06, 2019 2:42 am

Prashant wrote:
Sat Oct 05, 2019 6:01 pm
sameerph wrote:
Sat Oct 05, 2019 1:47 pm
Thanks, PKB for that tidbit. What is the difference between Coloureds like Philander and black Africans like Rabada ?
"Coloured" is S. African for mixed race. It is generally considered a pejorative / racist term in the US and most other English speaking parts of the world, and we probably shouldn't countenance it here.
There is absolutely no need for political correctness here. During the apartheid era, South Africa used an elaborate system of racial classification. (And yes, as prasen9 points out, NAACP in the US stands for the National Association for the Advancement of Colored People). There is much history over South Africa's "Coloured" classification, which applied for instance to Basil D'Oliveira (who appeared pretty white to most of us, but was considered "Coloured" in South Africa and hence barred from playing cricket there; he may, in his prime, have been a better all-rounder than Garry Sobers, but we'll never know because he started playing county cricket only when he was 34, and then played for England a couple of years later!).

"Coloured" is a very interesting category, lost now in the mists of history. The vast majority of "Coloureds" in South Africa were brought to the country (mainly the Cape Province) from India and especially what is now Indonesia in the 16th and 17th century. A small proportion of the latter remained Muslims and are known today as the "Cape Malays". The vast majority converted to Christianity, inter-married and hence became multi-hued -- D'Oliveira and Herschelle Gibbs looked quite white to us, while Philander, Piedt etc look almost Indian. The most famous Coloured politician was Trevor Manuel, who became Finance Minister of South Africa under Nelson Mandela and served for 13 years. Coloured cricketers include Paul Adams, Charl Langeveldt, Ashwell Prince, JP Duminy, Robin Peterson, Gibbs and Philander.



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Re: South Africa in India, Sept-Oct 2019

Post by prasen9 » Sun Oct 06, 2019 3:30 am

I have called myself (and us Indians) a colored person(s) here in public and not very many raised a brow.



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Re: South Africa in India, Sept-Oct 2019

Post by PKBasu » Sun Oct 06, 2019 5:20 am

PKBasu wrote:
Sat Oct 05, 2019 12:00 pm
A maximum of 98 overs possible tomorrow. So the revised target is 395 in 107 overs, or 384 (with 9 wickets in hand) off 98 overs. Tough ask for SA. But India need early wickets on the final morning. I would start with the pacers, to exploit the uneven bounce on the fifth morning.
Kohli didn't exactly follow the advice implicit in my post yesterday, but it is Mohammed Shami who has beautifully exploited the uneven bounce today with cutters (perfect seam bowling) that has the batsmen in a twist.



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Re: South Africa in India, Sept-Oct 2019

Post by Sin Hombre » Sun Oct 06, 2019 5:26 am

SA have completely collapsed in the first session on day 5.



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Re: South Africa in India, Sept-Oct 2019

Post by PKBasu » Sun Oct 06, 2019 5:27 am

prasen9 wrote:
Sat Oct 05, 2019 3:12 pm
We have been playing with one bowler for four days. Jadeja has been very useful as a batsman in getting quick runs. But, we need another bowler to stand up and run through the RSA batting.
Jadeja (8-4-17-4) demonstrates again why he is an all-format all-rounder!



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Re: South Africa in India, Sept-Oct 2019

Post by PKBasu » Sun Oct 06, 2019 5:29 am

Shami, who took wickets in 2 successive overs and then conceded four in the next one, is replaced by Ashwin. Our pacers have legitimate reasons to be quite angry with the skipper!



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Re: South Africa in India, Sept-Oct 2019

Post by PKBasu » Sun Oct 06, 2019 5:49 am

Excellent bowling this morning by Shami, Jadeja and Ashwin. But now the tail mustn't be allowed to thwart us for too long...



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Re: South Africa in India, Sept-Oct 2019

Post by PKBasu » Sun Oct 06, 2019 5:59 am

Ishant should be allowed to finish off the tail alongside Shami. You can't have a frontline bowler bowling just 3 overs in an innings...



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Re: South Africa in India, Sept-Oct 2019

Post by PKBasu » Sun Oct 06, 2019 9:07 am

We let them get at least 100 extra runs in the end, but a 203 run win is still pretty emphatic -- especially after a whole session was lost on the first day, and rain interruptions kept occurring on the rest of the days. Really comprehensive team performance.

We must stop playing test matches at the smaller, unknown grounds. Let Vizag, Pune, Ranchi host ODIs and T20Is by all means. But the tests should be played at Bombay, Calcutta, Delhi, Madras, Bangalore, Kanpur -- the traditional test grounds, where there is a large audience for test matches. By not nurturing them, we are destroying the traditional test venues' audiences as well.



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Re: South Africa in India, Sept-Oct 2019

Post by prasen9 » Sun Oct 06, 2019 8:31 pm

I think the key bowling performance was Shami's. He converted the match from having a substantial draw probability to a win for India. The next key was Ashwin's, who got us the lead.

Jadeja was okay. He got six wickets but at 35 runs/wicket. That is somewhat disappointing (the runs/wicket) in India. The six wickets was good. Jadeja's batting and fielding makes him more of an asset. Kuldeep's test bowling is about the same as Jadeja's, marginally better.

Ishant was pretty bad. But, I suppose everyone has a bad match. He has been Bumrah-esque in the last two years or so. So, he is bound to regress to the mean I suppose.

Rohit and Mayank were exceptional. Jadeja and Kohli batted very well. Pujara and Rahane batted well too. Saha and Vihari hit out and did not get a chance to build an innings.

The pitch was okay but did not do us any favors towards *winning* the WC. We need wickets that will show up the flat-track bullies. We don't need grass as we will get in New Zealand but we should roll in a bit of grass to give things a better bounce in the first two days and then faster spin than the dead, slow wicket in the last two days. Still, not a bad pitch but a tad worse than average imho.

Pune's wicket needs to be better than last time's. It needs to be a good sporting wicket, of course, Indian style, meaning breaking up in the last two days.



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Re: South Africa in India, Sept-Oct 2019

Post by prasen9 » Wed Oct 09, 2019 5:05 pm

The pitch has some grass. Please leave that on but don't water it too much so that it breaks on Day 4 and Day 5. Vizag did nothing for us with respect to building a team that can win in England. Or NZ. Or Aus for that matter. The best preparation is to have a fastish, bouncy wicket in Inning 1 and a cracked up one in Inn 2. That way we will get the points but also figure out who among the team can bat and bowl on fastish pitches.



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Re: South Africa in India, Sept-Oct 2019

Post by jaydeep » Wed Oct 09, 2019 5:44 pm

It's raining in Pune. So the ball can be swinging due to overcast and little moisture on the pitch.



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Re: South Africa in India, Sept-Oct 2019

Post by prasen9 » Thu Oct 10, 2019 1:14 am

If it is seriously moist and overcast, then we have to shave the grass a bit more to make sure it does not go bananas!



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