India in West Indies 2019

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Sin Hombre
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Re: India in West Indies 2019

Post by Sin Hombre » Sat Aug 10, 2019 2:15 am

Produce match winning performances with either bat or ball, not pad stats.

Kedar has done nothing in that regard since that home match against England 2 years back.



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Re: India in West Indies 2019

Post by prasen9 » Sat Aug 10, 2019 3:13 pm

Kohli said D. Chahar can be as good as Bhuvi. That is terrible news. Bhuvi is a terrible ODI bowler. He averages around 35 and can only keep it quiet consistently in the opening overs with the new ball. If Chahar's ceiling is Bhuvi, then we should rather invest in someone with real strike power. Ideally, your all-rounder can be the container. You need the opening bowlers to take wickets. How good is his batting? Admittedly, I have not seen Chahar much. Hence the question.

Bhuvi is great in swinging conditions.



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Re: India in West Indies 2019

Post by prasen9 » Sun Aug 11, 2019 7:29 am

Sin Hombre wrote:
Sat Aug 10, 2019 2:15 am
Produce match winning performances with either bat or ball, not pad stats.
By that token, except Dhawan, Kohli, and Rohit, nobody else has. So we should dump all of them. I also do not think Kedar got that many chances to "win" a match on his own. But, I will check the record to find out if this has any merit.

My problem is that he is old. And, if we are building for the next world cup, we must start now and give chances to players who will still be playing then. Or the next Champions Trophy. So, I would be fine replacing Kedar with Manish. But, let us call it what it is. Ageism.

His performance has been fine. That is, if we kick him out, we should also kick Rahul out at least. And, give a short leash to Iyer and Pandey and kick them out if they cannot win matches in the few chances they get. Expecting every member of a team to be a match-winner is delusional. We do not have that many match-winners who can win us matches every few chances they get.



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Re: India in West Indies 2019

Post by prasen9 » Sun Aug 11, 2019 3:36 pm

Pant is total crap in ODIs and T20Is. Maybe in T20Is, you can have him as a keeper bat batting at #7. But, in ODIs, he is largely inadequate because he does not know how to rotate the strike at will. It is stupid to bring him in when we needed to consolidate. He is good when he can come in and hit. Not at #4. Somewhat paradoxically, people like Sehwag, Warner, etc. are actually more effective in test cricket. Pant is quite effective in tests where he can play naturally. In ODIs, he tries to be too defensive and too aggressive. It is clear that he is not yet ready.



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Re: India in West Indies 2019

Post by Sin Hombre » Sun Aug 11, 2019 4:22 pm

Kohli with another century in a bilateral series after failing to do so at the WC.
prasen9 wrote:
Sun Aug 11, 2019 7:29 am
By that token, except Dhawan, Kohli, and Rohit, nobody else has. So we should dump all of them.
We should dump the likes of Kedar, old Dhoni, KL.
My problem is that he is old. And, if we are building for the next world cup, we must start now and give chances to players who will still be playing then. Or the next Champions Trophy. So, I would be fine replacing Kedar with Manish. But, let us call it what it is. Ageism.
Age is only one part.

It is the lack of performances. Poor fielding. Can't be relied on and gets injured easily. Dibbly dobbly bowling is ineffective outside India.
And, give a short leash to Iyer and Pandey and kick them out if they cannot win matches in the few chances they get. Expecting every member of a team to be a match-winner is delusional. We do not have that many match-winners who can win us matches every few chances they get.
Iyer has not been given 20 matches. If he fails in those, kick him out.

The objective for India should be to emulate 2011-13 when we had matchwinners like Yuvi and Dhoni in the middle order. We have the talent pool for it.

Iyer and Gill should be guaranteed a spot for the next 12 months.



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Re: India in West Indies 2019

Post by ssp » Sun Aug 11, 2019 5:33 pm

Poor batting since Kohli got out. Not rotating the strike, no big hits and losing wickets.
Ended up about 20 runs short. Good bowling at the end by the Windies.
Last edited by ssp on Sun Aug 11, 2019 5:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.



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Re: India in West Indies 2019

Post by Sin Hombre » Sun Aug 11, 2019 5:45 pm

67 runs in the last 10 overs. Another pathetic performance from Kedar and the tail.



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Re: India in West Indies 2019

Post by prasen9 » Mon Aug 12, 2019 8:32 am

Sin Hombre wrote:
Sun Aug 11, 2019 5:45 pm
67 runs in the last 10 overs. Another pathetic performance from Kedar and the tail.
Failure by Jadeja to hit big. He can blame one ball when he refused the single. He managed to keep his wicket but, he was unable to get his shots going. Bhuvi failed with the bat. Shami, we know, is awful.

I hope Iyer learns from this dismissal. Both Pant and Iyer fell to awful shot selection. Iyer did not need to take stance outside the off-stump even before the ball was bowled. Awful batting by Pant and Rohit. And Dhawan.

So, poor batting all around. Kohli and Iyer saved us.

We should try the young ones. Give 20 innings to Manish, Iyer, Pant, etc. Whoever succeeds, keep them. Move on to the next.

Because of his age and class, I would not dump Rahul totally but maybe he should be sent to the A-team with specific instructions on what to do to improve.

If you want a solid middle order and a solid lower order, get rid of the top order. Dump Dhawan, Rohit, and Kohli for now. That way, the middle and lower order will get more chances and we will know who can bat and who cannot.



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Re: India in West Indies 2019

Post by prasen9 » Tue Aug 13, 2019 6:10 am

Crazy selection by West Indies. Their batting crumbles a lot but there is still no place for Ambris and Campbell? Chase for ODIs?



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Re: India in West Indies 2019

Post by PKBasu » Tue Aug 13, 2019 6:27 am

I'm baffled as to why Shreyas Iyer wasn't in the World Cup squad, or in the squad for the previous series leading up to the World Cup. He had scores of 9, 88, 65, 18 and 30 in ODIs previously (all played between December 2017 and February 2018), averaging 42. In the last of those, he made 30 off 37 balls in Port Elizabeth -- certainly not anything that should warrant banishment from the team for more than a year. Bizarre!
Was he injured perhaps? Even if he was, his record should have made him an automatic pick on his return from injury. If this is the way we treat successful youngsters, no wonder we were struggling to fill the #4 slot in the middle order. After 6 innings (8 ODIs), Iyer is now averaging 46.83 at a strike rate of 98+. Why oh why wasn't he in the squad for England??

(And, sure to warm the cockles of Jay's heart, his dad is Malayali -- although mother is Tulu. Another Kerala boy plying his cricket trade in Mumbai, like Kuruvila).



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Re: India in West Indies 2019

Post by prasen9 » Tue Aug 13, 2019 9:19 am

No, it is because Shastri and Kohli wanted old guys. That is why Rahul, Iyer, and Pandey were never given a full, fair run. Similarly, Pant was denied. Pant may not be ready but he will only learn if we give him a set of chances. He will see what his shortcomings are and then can either fix it in the international arena or will have to go back to the domestics and learn. Iyer and Pandey were given the Saurav Tiwary treatment. And the Manoj Tiwari treatment.

There are Tulus in Kerala (north part of the state?) no? So, maybe Kerala can claim him whole.



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Re: India in West Indies 2019

Post by ssp » Wed Aug 14, 2019 2:44 pm

Windies openers thrashing our 'quick' bowlers. 114/0 after 10 overs!!



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Re: India in West Indies 2019

Post by prasen9 » Wed Aug 14, 2019 3:39 pm

Because of Kohli's stupidity. I would have brought on Jadeja or Chahal early on in order to change the pace.



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Re: India in West Indies 2019

Post by Sin Hombre » Thu Aug 15, 2019 1:23 am

Typical Kohli

He will point to yet another century in a bilateral to his critics though.



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Re: India in West Indies 2019

Post by PKBasu » Thu Aug 15, 2019 8:56 am

Shreyas Iyer again made the selectors look silly for ignoring him for so long.

(With regard to Saurabh Tiwary, he was perhaps his own worst enemy, because he quickly got fat and unfit, and was never a good enough fielder; but he has an infinite batting average, because I don't think he ever got out while playing 3 ODIs for India..).



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