European and Asian ATP / WTA tournaments Sept-Oct 2017

This is a forum where users can follow various tournaments that have Indian participation or are held in India. GrandSlams and Davis Cup should also be discussed here.

Moderator: Moderators

User avatar
prasen9
Member
Member
Posts: 12485
Joined: Thu Jan 02, 2003 8:49 pm
Please enter the middle number: 1
Location: State College, PA
Contact:

Re: European and Asian ATP / WTA tournaments Sept-Oct 2017

Post by prasen9 » Thu Oct 19, 2017 10:00 pm

The reward for defeating seed #3 is that you get seed #2.

User avatar
knarayen
Member
Member
Posts: 898
Joined: Tue Sep 02, 2003 1:29 am

Re: European and Asian ATP / WTA tournaments Sept-Oct 2017

Post by knarayen » Thu Oct 19, 2017 10:25 pm

fabshab wrote:
Thu Oct 19, 2017 8:45 pm
PKBasu wrote:
Thu Oct 19, 2017 12:40 pm
But I don't think Dzumhur could have received coaching in the middle of the match, except if there was some kind of break in play.
He kept on saying something to the coach after every point who was sitting on the spectators box and it was the fist pumps and some general indications from the sidelines which kept him going while there was no one to whom yuki could look up to :-(
Yuki has managed all these years on his own - for some time he had a guy (forget his name) who was his fitness consultant who was traveling with him. That helped him a lot if I remember correctly. At this stage, whoever Yuki chooses has to click and this is not an easy thing. The dependence on a coach is a double-edged sword - coaches are many times not permanent and the one that works well with you can also move on at some stage leaving you in the lurch - and that can impact your game negatively as well. Yuki has the kind of personality where a dependence on a coach may not work - this actually works in his favor at the moment.

User avatar
VReddy
Member
Member
Posts: 613
Joined: Fri Jan 27, 2006 3:34 pm
Please enter the middle number: 1
Location: Zurich, Switzerland
Contact:

Re: European and Asian ATP / WTA tournaments Sept-Oct 2017

Post by VReddy » Fri Oct 20, 2017 12:24 am

fabshab wrote:
Thu Oct 19, 2017 11:12 am
PKBasu wrote:
Thu Oct 19, 2017 10:44 am

He had big chances to win it against Dzumhur, and has to figure out how to close out such situations without succumbing to nerves. A similar mental block prevented him from beating Dustin Brown on grass. These are the types of matches that can multiply one's confidence (yesterday's and the grass match against Brown).
He well and truly needs a team....i dont know what AITA basically build for...jus for conducting nationals....cant they see a player who has some world class abilities needs some assistance
Jus give him a year with a ful fledged team and i guess he can pay back for sure
In the second set damir was looking totally out of answers and kept constantly talking to his coach who made him belief that he has the ability to do it and he was altogether a different player in the 3rd set
That is what a team can do
I dont know when our associations would do justice to our players whether it be boxing or tennis or hockey
And then we talk about the olympic medals and all We have talent but these corrupted officials jus wants to fill their stomachs thats it
And we will always be short of talent on paper though reality is vastly different
I beg to differ. AITA exists / operates like that because the Indian Tennis community doesn't appear to be much different. I read recently that Mahak couldn't play the French Open recently due to funds, while I have some reservations, if it is indeed true, assuming lot of folks were aware of the situation, speaks of clear lack of empathy amongst the tennis community members there. Don't tell me all of them are so poor that they can't just personally take care of Mahak's participation in FO even if its just a band-aid fix.

Regd Yuki funding
(A) Institution / Player funding: AP Govt/TOPS scheme / Gujarat Govt / etc,. seem to have schemes which fund upto 10-70lakhs per yr. If they still need, have Yuki's representatives atleast had a meeting with Manish Sisodia / Arvind Kejriwal or somebody related to Delhi Govt youth affairs
(B) Based on TOPS scheme alone, Yuki is allocated around Rs 20-35 lakhs a year. If somebody puts in 15-20 lakhs more, you are looking at somebody traveling with Yuki all the time
(C) Assuming everything above is a failure (though I disagree), what have we done as a tennisindia.org community apart from blaming AITA all the time? From the BSharma days, we keep having a discussion about a Sports Fund but the initiative ends as quickly as it starts. While the Sports Fund idea itself is complicated when its get into player selection stage. With Yuki Bhambri, we have as non-controverial case as it can get.

I am sure given the number of IITians / NRIs / Tennis official / influential folks that exist on this forum, if most of us spent a day or two trying to do an outreach around Yuki funding issue, it would have been resolved by now (if the problem exists in the first place).

Long story short. AITA operates as it is because of how the Indian Tennis Community is (including us fans!).

User avatar
PKBasu
Member
Member
Posts: 32332
Joined: Fri Jan 03, 2003 6:04 pm
Please enter the middle number: 1
Location: Singapore

Re: European and Asian ATP / WTA tournaments Sept-Oct 2017

Post by PKBasu » Fri Oct 20, 2017 4:44 am

prasen9 wrote:
Thu Oct 19, 2017 10:00 pm
The reward for defeating seed #3 is that you get seed #2.
The top seeded Bryan twins have been knocked out. So the winner of this SF is likely to win the title. Big chance for Sharan/Lipsky.

srinath
Member
Member
Posts: 19
Joined: Thu Oct 22, 2015 7:39 am
Antispam: No
Please enter the middle number: 5

Re: European and Asian ATP / WTA tournaments Sept-Oct 2017

Post by srinath » Fri Oct 20, 2017 5:03 am

If we think individual contributions is the way out for the top ranked indian who is also a junior grand slam winner then it is an extremely sad situation. Then to say Aita can't be criticised because people in a forum didn't contribute money towards that cause is something I am not able to understand

Love reading the comments on the forum.

S_K_S
Member
Member
Posts: 3265
Joined: Sun Jan 05, 2003 7:00 pm
Antispam: No
Please enter the middle number: 5
Location: Birmingham, UK

Re: European and Asian ATP / WTA tournaments Sept-Oct 2017

Post by S_K_S » Fri Oct 20, 2017 9:19 am

What a win by Lipsky and Sharan. To take out Klaasen/Ram is a big feather in their cap. Let's take the title now.

Wasn't going to comment on the whole funding thing as it's the same stuff all over again but I was irked by the comment that fans haven't done anything. I think there are many in here, especially Jay, to whom it is very disrespectful to say that. Just because people don't shout about it from the roof tops doesn't mean they haven't helped.

User avatar
VReddy
Member
Member
Posts: 613
Joined: Fri Jan 27, 2006 3:34 pm
Please enter the middle number: 1
Location: Zurich, Switzerland
Contact:

Re: European and Asian ATP / WTA tournaments Sept-Oct 2017

Post by VReddy » Fri Oct 20, 2017 9:33 am

S_K_S wrote:
Fri Oct 20, 2017 9:19 am
What a win by Lipsky and Sharan. To take out Klaasen/Ram is a big feather in their cap. Let's take the title now.

Wasn't going to comment on the whole funding thing as it's the same stuff all over again but I was irked by the comment that fans haven't done anything. I think there are many in here, especially Jay, to whom it is very disrespectful to say that. Just because people don't shout about it from the roof tops doesn't mean they haven't helped.
Yes when I re-read, it doesn't come across the way I meant. Will edit/remove it - not appropriate.

My point was - (a) Yuki has received decent funding from the Govt sources in the last 2-3 yrs atleast if we go by TOPS scheme reports (b) The player/official community could do much better to help each other for some basic cases in their personal level (c) If a/b don't work, fans could step and do something more too as he is once in a generation talent

I would still say comment (c) is applicable at a broader level. However, without the right setting, this discussion will go into individual examples which is not at all relevant. BTW - Jay is the reason I have been even able to follow Tennis back then.

If we see thread around AITA, I am the one whining about it the most in the last 3-4 pages. The above comments are something I would still stick by in broader sense but lets pause it for a later discussion. Unfortunately, I can't edit the previous post anymore as its too old now. Cheers!

User avatar
jayakris
Moderators
Moderators
Posts: 24098
Joined: Mon Dec 16, 2002 7:24 am
Please enter the middle number: 1
Location: Irvine, CA, USA
Contact:

Re: European and Asian ATP / WTA tournaments Sept-Oct 2017

Post by jayakris » Fri Oct 20, 2017 12:52 pm

Hey, I haven't done anything much, to thank me! ... We all did raise some good funds at one time in a big crunch, to help out Premjit Lall who was in bad health trouble, but other than that we have never raised funds. As all of you discussed, it is just not easy, other than in some one-time effort for specific contingencies. To do something big regularly for some 2 or 3 top players, we need to raise at least, say, a US$ 50K every year, and we just don't have the numbers for that, in this forum. Plus, there are a lot of sports promoters and agents in India who are better at it than us (in finding corporate money). For a couple of players like Nirupama Sanjeev and Harsh Mankad, we had once helped find some small sponsorships.

I am sure all of you would come through if need to raise funds for a deserving player, if the player or a friend/agent of his would let us know (like when we offered to raise funds for a junior player for US Open just recently). We can indeed raise something like a $4000 for a very promising type of junior player, say, to not miss a grand slam or two. The player needs to be really good and the case needs to be clear, because the cokmunity here has some pretty good judgment on player quality. I am sure many of you are willing to help. But, ultimately somebody from the player's side need to take some initiative and contact us for help. That has almost never really happened. Two hands are needed to clap. The player side never seems to want to ask, and in the end, I think in many cases it is also because they know they can find enough money and are finding excuses not to, or they just don't have the initiative - in either case, we can't do a whole lot, much as we all would love to help in our own small way.

One problem in players getting AITA's support is that players just don't trust them much, and won't sign on for anything (which is probably justifiable), but AITA have generally wanted to have some control on the players' development if they are putting their money on a player. Many of the top juniors in the past have not agreed to give AITA enough control on things (like telling them exactly where they are playing and why, and all that, I assume). This is all rather normal with most national associations program. Some of the associations have built some level of trust because people who really know the tour well and have experience are part of such associations. AITA has never had that reputation, so players just don't trust their advice at all, and they hate to be under some watch and control by AITA. The players often show arrgance to AITA and they don't take kindly to it either. No real chemistry there. Then the top players may find some support from elsewhere and they will go for that rather than kowtow to AITA. On AITA's side, they will just say "hey, what can we do? the player doesn't want to listen to our requirements, so how can we just give govrnment's money away?". There is some fault and some justification on both sides, but that is the situation. AITA needs to become more professional with experienced former players running it, to develop some trust (but former national players and athletes in India, in every sport, tend to be not too professional either - and are more political than professional; which is our national culture) but one family running it for ages, has not helped. So, there you have the problem. The hands don't clap. In the end, the losers are often the players, but over time I have also felt that there is a fair amount of blame on them as well.

User avatar
jaydeep
Moderators
Moderators
Posts: 22392
Joined: Wed Aug 18, 2004 8:59 am
Please enter the middle number: 1
Location: India

Re: European and Asian ATP / WTA tournaments Sept-Oct 2017

Post by jaydeep » Fri Oct 20, 2017 1:04 pm

Divij-Lipsky scored another impressive win over seasoned doubles pair for entering into the final ... After losing the first set 06, they made an excellent comeback in the match and in end, won the match tie-break comfortably.

At €589K European Open 2017, Antwerp, Belgium

[SF] Scott Lipsky (USA)/ Divij Sharan (IND) bt (2) Ivan Dodig (CRO)/ Marcel Granollers (ESP) 06 64 10-5

User avatar
PKBasu
Member
Member
Posts: 32332
Joined: Fri Jan 03, 2003 6:04 pm
Please enter the middle number: 1
Location: Singapore

Re: European and Asian ATP / WTA tournaments Sept-Oct 2017

Post by PKBasu » Fri Oct 20, 2017 1:09 pm

Terrific win! The title is waiting tomorrow!!

Divij now 55 in the live rankings. The title will take him to a career-high 49th.
Scott Lipsky (who is 36 years old now) is only 76 in the live rankings (versus a career high of 21; but as a former partner, he must have had special intelligence on Rajeev Ram).

bujilover
Member
Member
Posts: 5284
Joined: Sat Sep 19, 2009 9:21 am
Antispam: No
Please enter the middle number: 5
Contact:

Re: European and Asian ATP / WTA tournaments Sept-Oct 2017

Post by bujilover » Fri Oct 20, 2017 1:28 pm

WOW!!! Great week for Divij. I’m starting to think Lipsky and Divij will continue to play together.

User avatar
Omkara
Member
Member
Posts: 4134
Joined: Thu Jan 20, 2005 9:03 am
Please enter the middle number: 1
Location: Mumbai
Contact:

Re: European and Asian ATP / WTA tournaments Sept-Oct 2017

Post by Omkara » Fri Oct 20, 2017 2:56 pm


User avatar
PKBasu
Member
Member
Posts: 32332
Joined: Fri Jan 03, 2003 6:04 pm
Please enter the middle number: 1
Location: Singapore

Re: European and Asian ATP / WTA tournaments Sept-Oct 2017

Post by PKBasu » Fri Oct 20, 2017 5:43 pm

Really close match, and Yuki seemed to hit the top of the net on crucial points in the final set.

User avatar
VReddy
Member
Member
Posts: 613
Joined: Fri Jan 27, 2006 3:34 pm
Please enter the middle number: 1
Location: Zurich, Switzerland
Contact:

Re: European and Asian ATP / WTA tournaments Sept-Oct 2017

Post by VReddy » Fri Oct 20, 2017 5:59 pm

jayakris wrote:
Fri Oct 20, 2017 12:52 pm
Hey, I haven't done anything much, to thank me! ... We all did raise some good funds at one time in a big crunch, to help out Premjit Lall who was in bad health trouble, but other than that we have never raised funds. As all of you discussed, it is just not easy, other than in some one-time effort for specific contingencies. To do something big regularly for some 2 or 3 top players, we need to raise at least, say, a US$ 50K every year, and we just don't have the numbers for that, in this forum. Plus, there are a lot of sports promoters and agents in India who are better at it than us (in finding corporate money). For a couple of players like Nirupama Sanjeev and Harsh Mankad, we had once helped find some small sponsorships.

I am sure all of you would come through if need to raise funds for a deserving player, if the player or a friend/agent of his would let us know (like when we offered to raise funds for a junior player for US Open just recently). We can indeed raise something like a $4000 for a very promising type of junior player, say, to not miss a grand slam or two. The player needs to be really good and the case needs to be clear, because the cokmunity here has some pretty good judgment on player quality. I am sure many of you are willing to help. But, ultimately somebody from the player's side need to take some initiative and contact us for help. That has almost never really happened. Two hands are needed to clap. The player side never seems to want to ask, and in the end, I think in many cases it is also because they know they can find enough money and are finding excuses not to, or they just don't have the initiative - in either case, we can't do a whole lot, much as we all would love to help in our own small way.

One problem in players getting AITA's support is that players just don't trust them much, and won't sign on for anything (which is probably justifiable), but AITA have generally wanted to have some control on the players' development if they are putting their money on a player. Many of the top juniors in the past have not agreed to give AITA enough control on things (like telling them exactly where they are playing and why, and all that, I assume). This is all rather normal with most national associations program. Some of the associations have built some level of trust because people who really know the tour well and have experience are part of such associations. AITA has never had that reputation, so players just don't trust their advice at all, and they hate to be under some watch and control by AITA. The players often show arrgance to AITA and they don't take kindly to it either. No real chemistry there. Then the top players may find some support from elsewhere and they will go for that rather than kowtow to AITA. On AITA's side, they will just say "hey, what can we do? the player doesn't want to listen to our requirements, so how can we just give govrnment's money away?". There is some fault and some justification on both sides, but that is the situation. AITA needs to become more professional with experienced former players running it, to develop some trust (but former national players and athletes in India, in every sport, tend to be not too professional either - and are more political than professional; which is our national culture) but one family running it for ages, has not helped. So, there you have the problem. The hands don't clap. In the end, the losers are often the players, but over time I have also felt that there is a fair amount of blame on them as well.
So well put as usual. This is super duper good info. Thank you for that insight, Jay.

sameerph
Moderators
Moderators
Posts: 24728
Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 4:26 pm
Antispam: No
Please enter the middle number: 5
Location: MUMBAI

Re: European and Asian ATP / WTA tournaments Sept-Oct 2017

Post by sameerph » Fri Oct 20, 2017 6:40 pm

Excellent performance by Divij and Lipsky. To beat 2 top notch pairs on the tour - Ram/Klassen and Dodig/Granollers is really top notch. This is fourth ATP final for Divij and first one with a partner other than Divij.

Go get the title.

Post Reply