What should the I-League look like?

[stoutekont]

India should start a new league, India Super League sounds like a nice one. Like MLS and IPL, with franchises. This could help Indian football a lot. Here's how it could look like:



Start with 10 clubs:

1 Mohun Bagan FC
2 East Bengal FC
3 Goa FC
4 Kerala FC
5 United Sikkim FC
6 Pune FC
7 New Delhi FC
8 Bangalore FC
9 Hyderabad FC
10 Chennai FC

[stoutekont]

1 Mumbai FC

2 Delhi FC

3 Bangalore FC

4 Hyderabad FC

5 Ahmedabad FC

6 Chennai FC

7 Kolkata FC

8 Surat FC

9 Pune FC

10 Jaipur FC

11 Lucknow FC

12 Kanpur FC

13 Nagpur FC

14 Indore FC


This is another option, but some new stadiums are needed then...

[stoutekont]

What should the I-League look like? I think we need franchises and some new stadiums, or the use of cricket stadiums:

1 Mohun Bagan
2 East Bengal
3 Pune FC
4 Mumbai FC
5 Goa United
6 Delhi FC
7 Shillong Lajong
8 United Sikkim
9 Viva Kerala
10 Bangalore SC

[stoutekont]

Chennai, Phagwara, Assam and Hyderabad could be expansion teams in the future.

[prasen9]

Without letting more foreigners play per team, the number of teams should not be increased. That would result in a loss of quality.

I would add a team from Punjab to the first list you have provided if we expand. Punjab had a long tradition in producing good footballers. Punjabis generally have better physique (anecdotal) and are fighters. So, Phagwara would be my first choice. A metro such as Chennai deserves a team. Then, Hyderabad. By pure population and media market, we should go with Ahmedabad. I don't know if Assam has that many footballers.

[munnabhai]

Without letting more foreigners play per team, the number of teams should not be increased. That would result in a loss of quality.

I would add a team from Punjab to the first list you have provided if we expand. Punjab had a long tradition in producing good footballers. Punjabis generally have better physique (anecdotal) and are fighters. So, Phagwara would be my first choice. A metro such as Chennai deserves a team. Then, Hyderabad. By pure population and media market, we should go with Ahmedabad. I don't know if Assam has that many footballers.

At the best of Indian football history during the 50s and 60s almost half of the team would be from Hyderabad, and all those players back then used to be 6ft tall and strong. Don't pigeon hole any part of the country into warriors and intellectuals. You can find gems of all kinds all over India if you have the will to find them.

http://www.dnaindia.com/sport/1180925/r ... -hyderabad

"Hyderabad has produced more Olympian footballers than any other city in the country. Alas, today there is hardly any trace of the 'Beautiful Game' in Andhra Pradesh and this year the state even failed to field a team in the National Championship in Srinagar in May.

The rulers of the erstwhile Hyderabad state patronised the game and football became the most popular sport for close to five decades till late 1970s, the 50s-70s period being the golden era.

Hyderabadi footballers formed the nucleus of the Indian team that took part in three Olympics -- 1952 (Helsinki), 1956 (Melbourne) and 1960 (Rome) under the coach Syed Abdul Rahim' s stewardship as he was also the secretary of the Hyderabad Football Association for 20 years (1943-1963).

The squad to Helsinki had three Hyderabadis -- Syed Khwaja Azizuddin, Noor Mohammed and S.K. Moinuddin. In Melbourne the number jumped to eight -- Peter Thangaraj, Azizuddin, Mohammed Abdul Salaam, Ahmed Hussain, Noor, J. Krishnaswamy, Dharmalingam Kannan, Tulsidas Balaram and Mohammmed Zulfikaruddin. In Melbourne, India finished fourth, their best ever performance in the Olympics.

The Italian capital in the summer of 1960 also saw six Hyderabadis -- Thangaraj, Yusuf Khan, S.S. Hakeem, Balaram, Kannan and Habibul Hasan Hamid in the Olympic team. "


Do not forget the legacy of those Hyderabadis. Hyderabad needs a team for sure.

[prasen9]

If you need to add a team, the system of playing a second division and relegating the bottom teams and moving the second division champion up seems like the best option. That way we do not have to play favorites.

With respect to warriors, no sir. People from all states may have it in them and may have contributed. But the amount of armed resistance against the British was significantly more (even considering a per-capita basis) from the state of Punjab than from Hyderabad, per my knowledge. I would be glad to be proven wrong if the numbers say otherwise. While I was growing up, anecdotally, a significant number of army personnel were from Punjab. The last WC cricket winning team had 4-5 Punjabis (some from Delhi). Unless there are numbers that prove that these impressions are wrong, I will continue to harbor my biases.

With respect to football, it is a slam dunk. Hyderabad is a knockout in the first round. Santosh Trophy winners: List One has to go back to 1958 when Hyderabad last won. Punjab has won twice in the 2000s, four times in the '80s, and twice in the '70s while Hyderabadis were enjoying their '58 triumph and basking in that glory.

p.s. And I know that the Santosh Trophy had the annoying habit of having people represent the state of the club in which they play. So, Thangaraj did play for Bengal's winning team in '63, etc. But, in the '80s and '90s when I followed football, there were many good players from Punjab and few from Hyderabad.

[munnabhai]

If you need to add a team, the system of playing a second division and relegating the bottom teams and moving the second division champion up seems like the best option. That way we do not have to play favorites.

With respect to warriors, no sir. People from all states may have it in them and may have contributed. But the amount of armed resistance against the British was significantly more (even considering a per-capita basis) from the state of Punjab than from Hyderabad, per my knowledge. I would be glad to be proven wrong if the numbers say otherwise. While I was growing up, anecdotally, a significant number of army personnel were from Punjab. The last WC cricket winning team had 4-5 Punjabis (some from Delhi). Unless there are numbers that prove that these impressions are wrong, I will continue to harbor my biases.

With respect to football, it is a slam dunk. Hyderabad is a knockout in the first round. Santosh Trophy winners: List One has to go back to 1958 when Hyderabad last won. Punjab has won twice in the 2000s, four times in the '80s, and twice in the '70s while Hyderabadis were enjoying their '58 triumph and basking in that glory.

p.s. And I know that the Santosh Trophy had the annoying habit of having people represent the state of the club in which they play. So, Thangaraj did play for Bengal's winning team in '63, etc. But, in the '80s and '90s when I followed football, there were many good players from Punjab and few from Hyderabad.

Well, if you want to measure which area has more "warriors" based on how many people joined the armed resistance against the British I would say your logic is flawed. You would find 0 armed resistances against the British in the former state of Hyderabad because we were under the rule of the Nizams of Hyderabad and we had our own armed communist struggle against the Nizams which you probably have never even heard about because Bollywood never makes a movie on it. I do because my grand father was a freedom fighter in the former state of the Nizams and was later part of the original communist party of India.

You might be right that more "warriors" from the Punjab region join the Indian army but I would say that argument is also flawed because you are not considering the logistics and history which motivates more people from Punjab to join the army. It would be synonymous to me saying more "warriors" from Telangana and the Hyderabad region join the Naxalite and Maoist movement, so it proves that there are more warriors in the Hyderabad region. 99% of the leaders of the Maoist movement are from Andhra Pradesh, I don't agree with their ideologies but they are not cowards my friend.

Anyways, judging by how illogical and biased our arguments are on this thread we can assume that this is how silly the meetings in the AIFF boardrooms are going to be.

One guy says "we need a team in Punjab because we have the MOST warriors"

Other guy says "What are you talking about? What about the Gurkhas? They are just as fierce as the Punjabis"

Another guy says "We Hyderabadis were the founders of the communist party of India and had our own armed struggle, we are warriors too!!"

The Kerala guy says " Um....hello? We are the Communist party of India at the moment....what about our warrior status?"

The members from Goa and Bengal are arguing about who is the king of football in India.

The members from the North East are being super polite and waiting for their moment to say they deserve a team.

Meanwhile the Indian football team is getting their butts handed by Singapore and Thailand.

We are doomed....

[munnabhai]

Prasen, I agree with your first statement completely. The relegating system between the 1st and 2nd division is the way to go.

[usaindia]

I-League: JSW and a steely football resolve

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/spor ... 320288.cms

[prasen9]

I agree 100% that taking part in the freedom movement or membership in the army is not a basis for including a team. I was explaining why I am biased towards Punjabis. I have never chosen my students on the basis of their race. I told you how I would choose and you agree with that.

Of course, the AP tribals are not cowards. I did not label any race as coward and will not. Some are merely apathetic. Not good does not mean bad. And, of course, if cornered every community will fight.

And, btw, I do not watch Bollywood movies. I do not know much about Hyderabad's history but I knew that the Nizams ruled Hyderabad until one year after independence and the state was annexed by Sardar Patel's operation. I had forgotten that while writing the previous post. I believe that the last Nizam was a reasonably benevolent person and thus there was not much animosity which would provoke the locals to overthrow him. I admit I should go and read up more.

[munnabhai]

Yea, it is understandable that you don't know the actual history of the communist upsurge in the old Hyderabad state and the current maoist movement. I admire the fact that you admit that you don't know that part of history. I just want to give you a tiny bit better perspective on it.

It is a misconception that the maoist movement in India is just a tribal movement, it became a tribal movement because authorities killed thousands and thousands of communist militia and naxalites over the last 50 years in and around the non-forested regions.

The original communist militia were not tribals, they were farmers fighting against the feudal aspects of the Hyderabad State. The leadership included Hindus, Muslims, rich farmers, poor farmers, lawyers, doctors, people from every strata of life. But they were mainly farmers. My grandfather told me that before the Independence around 5000 of these militia died fighting the feudalism in Hyderabad and the Razakars of the Nizams.

The naxalite movement originally until the early 70's was about a mass movement to take away feudalism, clean up corruption in politics and the civil society. The intellectual leadership died off due to police encounters and over time the wrong people took over the movement. The naxalites became more about "fighting" and less about "mass movements" to change the system. Criminal thugs used the Naxalite movement to rob and plunder rich people, that is when the police in AP started stepping up and killed all of them off in encounter killings. You won't find an official number on how many people were encountered but it was a lot since our independence.

There are still intellectuals left in the violent communist movement and they moved into the forests to avoid encounter killings. They now fight the system with the help of the "tribals" as you mentioned. But the movement is not a tribal one, that is a misconception.

Just so you know the leader of the supposed Maoist movement until 2011 was Kisanji.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kishenji

"Kishenji was born into a poor family in Peddapalli (in the district of Karimnagar, Andhra Pradesh) which eked out a living on priesthood in near by temples.[8] Ironically, his grandfather was known to be a freedom fighter.[8] He claimed that his father was also a freedom fighter.[7] In 1973, after a B.Sc. degree from SSR College at Warangal,[8] he moved to Hyderabad to pursue law. His father was the vice-president of the state branch of the Congress Socialist Party. When he joined the Communist Party of India (Marxist-Leninist), his father left the Indian National Congress saying, two kinds of politics cannot survive under one roof. His father believed in socialism, but not in armed struggle."


I just wanted to give you a perspective. The communist movement is not of the "tribals" of AP as you think. It used to be a movement led by farmers and educated intellectual communists, it became a tribal movement over time because they found a save heaven against encounter killings by moving to the forests. Their goal is to not just give rights to the tribals, their goal is to get rid of corruption in the Indian system. The Indian media is terrible in actually giving perspective to the movement, they pigeon hole the movement into saying it is only for the tribals. It BECAME a tribal movement because of logistics and because of the atrocities the tribals faced due to corruption.

Mods: Sorry for writing this in the wrong thread. You can move it to the general discussion if you would like.
P.S I do not agree with the maoist ideologies. I just know their history and their point of view.

[prasen9]

Munnabhai,

Thanks for this. I know a bit about Naxalbari where the movement originated. The Naxals tried to mistakenly kill my father, who was apolitical, thinking he was a local political leader. Actually, there is a difference between the Communists and the Maoists (Marxist-Leninist)s. But, I don't know the details of what happened in AP. Thanks for the post. I find AP to be one of the states where social inequality is perhaps the most. Again, anecdotal evidence. I'll write more if I get the time.

Jay, or someone else, can you please move the last few posts to somewhere else? Sorry for the inconvenience.

--Prasenjit

[stoutekont]

http://www.stadiumzone.weebly.com

has pictures of possible venues for future I-League teams. There are serious plans to built a big soccer stadium in Ahmedabad. When will Mumbai built a new football stadium?